Obama in Wonderland
4:50 AM
by Nick Stone of Drawnlines Politics.
It should be considered ironic that a president that twice took the same oath of office to uphold the constitution and defend our country has seemingly forgotten his pledge upon taking office.
President Obama’s foreign policy is absolutely abysmal, and the time to say so is overdue. Worse yet, he wants to bring the fruits of that bad foreign policy onto the homeland voluntarily by parading terrorists on our soil and extending them the same rights given exclusively to American citizens by purview of the Constitution. His salt-in-the-open-wound strategy of non-defense is inexcusable to those who have suffered the ultimate loss due to weakness of policies pursued in the past. New Yorkers of both parties are having a tough time keeping a straight face as the president’s AG sends terrorists on an all expense paid trip to the Big Apple for the show trials of the millennium.
Mayor Rudy Giuliani told Neil Cavuto, “This was an act of war. One of the things I thought we learned from September 11 was that we were in a state of denial before September 11.” On trying terrorists inside the US, Giuliani added, “We went through this once before in 1993. Terrorists attacked the WTC, we did not recognize it as an act of war. We tried them in the Southern District in NY. It did no good.” Democrat and New York Governor David Patterson also said he would not have made the decision to try KSM in New York. Democratic Senator Jim Webb who served as Secretary of the Navy under President Reagan has been an outspoken critic of the idea of bringing detainees onto US soil.
In a world where it is ok to call Republicans extremists, but unacceptable to call islamofascists what they are, perhaps it should be no surprise to note a politics-before-policy strategy coming from the same White House that once called the Afghan War a “must win” while campaigning against the surge strategy in Iraq that ultimately turned around years of heavy losses. The Obama fantasyland is one where killing American soldiers and families on our own soil is quote, “not [cause] to jump to conclusions.” This attitude comes from the same president that kicked reporters off of his plane because their editorial boards supported Senator McCain’s election, the same president that declared war on Fox News, and whose White House claims tea party attendees as “un-American.”
The Red Queen is "off with her head". It’s time to wake up to the denial inherent in this president’s psychotic world view. We can't chase this rabbit down the hole anymore.
Candidate Obama clearly allied himself with the Left of our country (and in particular, trial lawyers) when he called for an end to military tribunals and an end to Guantanamo Bay. He also allied himself with the interests of those who would do and have done America harm. For Al Qaeda, the Taliban, and Islamofascists the world over, Obama is the gift that keeps on giving. Not only is he weakening America from within by returning to the failed economic policies of the Carter Administration, he also weakens her standing by proving the same or worse foreign policy weaknesses that Carter beset upon Lady Liberty.
There are several concrete problems with the trial of KSM in the United States, as well as a few abstract symbolic ones:
We didn’t arrest KSM inside the United States. When he was arrested, he wasn’t mirandized. He was interrogated using “enhanced interrogation techniques”. He will be guaranteed discovery rights which can and likely will reveal classified material. His admission of guilt, which has already been obtained, may well be inadmissible. Information given by KSM that led to other arrests of detainees may also be inadmissible or decided inculpable, setting up a domino effect of future acquittals. Ultimately, terrorists will be running free inside the United States simply because our case against them was dismantled by circumstance. This decision is a disaster of epic proportions.
Symbolically, Americans must ask themselves why the president is more interested in winning the war on Fox News than he is winning the War on Terrorism. Why is Attorney General Holder more comfortable with bringing down American interrogators than he is comfortable taking down the nefarious characters they water boarded? Is keeping his agenda alive more important than keeping American children, families, and soldiers alive?
This president apologizes for American values and intervention abroad, and chastises our way of life at home. He undermines our economy with his policies of record deficit spending, unprecedented government control of markets, shotgun marriages of massive failing institutions, and astronomical tax hikes in every facet of our lives. He undermines our world standing through the worst monetary policy in generations, a weakened and dispirited military with fewer resources than it needs, and by imposing upon American industry burdens unmatched by the rest of the industrialized world. The world watches as this president goes hat-in-hand to our enemies in Iran and North Korea, while at the same time criticizing our long-standing allies like Israel and Saudi Arabia. He throws our defense partners along the Eastern Bloc under the bus to appease The Bear, and doesn’t get anything for it in return. He undermines our credibility by illegitimating the elected governments in Iran and Afghanistan while working behind the scenes to reinstate the unconstitutional president of Honduras.
This president is weakening America with every move he makes. The malaise of the 1970s may soon be looked upon as comparatively prosperous. At least people were safe on US soil back then.
There's ALWAYS something new happening at Drawnlines Politics.
For videos and archives visit our homepage
Check out our new Election Center!
It should be considered ironic that a president that twice took the same oath of office to uphold the constitution and defend our country has seemingly forgotten his pledge upon taking office.
President Obama’s foreign policy is absolutely abysmal, and the time to say so is overdue. Worse yet, he wants to bring the fruits of that bad foreign policy onto the homeland voluntarily by parading terrorists on our soil and extending them the same rights given exclusively to American citizens by purview of the Constitution. His salt-in-the-open-wound strategy of non-defense is inexcusable to those who have suffered the ultimate loss due to weakness of policies pursued in the past. New Yorkers of both parties are having a tough time keeping a straight face as the president’s AG sends terrorists on an all expense paid trip to the Big Apple for the show trials of the millennium.
Mayor Rudy Giuliani told Neil Cavuto, “This was an act of war. One of the things I thought we learned from September 11 was that we were in a state of denial before September 11.” On trying terrorists inside the US, Giuliani added, “We went through this once before in 1993. Terrorists attacked the WTC, we did not recognize it as an act of war. We tried them in the Southern District in NY. It did no good.” Democrat and New York Governor David Patterson also said he would not have made the decision to try KSM in New York. Democratic Senator Jim Webb who served as Secretary of the Navy under President Reagan has been an outspoken critic of the idea of bringing detainees onto US soil.
In a world where it is ok to call Republicans extremists, but unacceptable to call islamofascists what they are, perhaps it should be no surprise to note a politics-before-policy strategy coming from the same White House that once called the Afghan War a “must win” while campaigning against the surge strategy in Iraq that ultimately turned around years of heavy losses. The Obama fantasyland is one where killing American soldiers and families on our own soil is quote, “not [cause] to jump to conclusions.” This attitude comes from the same president that kicked reporters off of his plane because their editorial boards supported Senator McCain’s election, the same president that declared war on Fox News, and whose White House claims tea party attendees as “un-American.”
The Red Queen is "off with her head". It’s time to wake up to the denial inherent in this president’s psychotic world view. We can't chase this rabbit down the hole anymore.
Candidate Obama clearly allied himself with the Left of our country (and in particular, trial lawyers) when he called for an end to military tribunals and an end to Guantanamo Bay. He also allied himself with the interests of those who would do and have done America harm. For Al Qaeda, the Taliban, and Islamofascists the world over, Obama is the gift that keeps on giving. Not only is he weakening America from within by returning to the failed economic policies of the Carter Administration, he also weakens her standing by proving the same or worse foreign policy weaknesses that Carter beset upon Lady Liberty.
There are several concrete problems with the trial of KSM in the United States, as well as a few abstract symbolic ones:
We didn’t arrest KSM inside the United States. When he was arrested, he wasn’t mirandized. He was interrogated using “enhanced interrogation techniques”. He will be guaranteed discovery rights which can and likely will reveal classified material. His admission of guilt, which has already been obtained, may well be inadmissible. Information given by KSM that led to other arrests of detainees may also be inadmissible or decided inculpable, setting up a domino effect of future acquittals. Ultimately, terrorists will be running free inside the United States simply because our case against them was dismantled by circumstance. This decision is a disaster of epic proportions.
Symbolically, Americans must ask themselves why the president is more interested in winning the war on Fox News than he is winning the War on Terrorism. Why is Attorney General Holder more comfortable with bringing down American interrogators than he is comfortable taking down the nefarious characters they water boarded? Is keeping his agenda alive more important than keeping American children, families, and soldiers alive?
This president apologizes for American values and intervention abroad, and chastises our way of life at home. He undermines our economy with his policies of record deficit spending, unprecedented government control of markets, shotgun marriages of massive failing institutions, and astronomical tax hikes in every facet of our lives. He undermines our world standing through the worst monetary policy in generations, a weakened and dispirited military with fewer resources than it needs, and by imposing upon American industry burdens unmatched by the rest of the industrialized world. The world watches as this president goes hat-in-hand to our enemies in Iran and North Korea, while at the same time criticizing our long-standing allies like Israel and Saudi Arabia. He throws our defense partners along the Eastern Bloc under the bus to appease The Bear, and doesn’t get anything for it in return. He undermines our credibility by illegitimating the elected governments in Iran and Afghanistan while working behind the scenes to reinstate the unconstitutional president of Honduras.
This president is weakening America with every move he makes. The malaise of the 1970s may soon be looked upon as comparatively prosperous. At least people were safe on US soil back then.
There's ALWAYS something new happening at Drawnlines Politics.
For videos and archives visit our homepage
Check out our new Election Center!
Posted by Nick Stone
on 4:50 AM.
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You are out of control. Public opinion of the United States in the world stage is up ten fold compared to what it was under George W. Bush. He has kept us "safe" for 11 months now. What else do you want?
In terms of trying KSM in the United States, in case you are unaware, we have done this before. We tried the first World Trade Center bombers here. We tried Zacarias Moussaoui here and he was the "20th highjacker." At what point did any of those terror trials go wrong? Never. We showed the world we had a fair justice system. At the same time, the two cases where national security intelligence would leak or there wouldn't be a sure-fire conviction are being tried in a military tribunal, still.
As far as you quoting Rudy Guiliani as a justifiable source (of course he was speaking to FOX News at the time), I urge you to watch this clip from The Daily Show. Granted it's a show that has a slight "liberal" bias, but in this case, John Stewart is dead on when he criticizes Rudy Guilani (and others) who were big proponents of bringing Moussaoui to the US for a trial.
http://gawker.com/5406279/rudy-guiliani-argues-with-himself-on-the-daily-show
I'm sure you are going to ignore this piece of logic, but should you happen to view it. Please respond with your comments.
Also you have to be drinking heavily if you think Obama "apologized for our way of life." He never did ANY such thing. He apologized for the racism and arrogance we exuded since 9/11. But in the same breath was quick to clarify that most of it was warranted, as 9/11 was an act of brutal murder. So again, you are incorrect.
Thank you for saying I'm out of control. Your example proves my point that in under the Obama regime, Republicans are extremists but we aren't to speak ill of terrorists. That's excellent.
Thanks furthermore for falling immediately into the trap of trying to illegitimize Fox News, but then immediately point to Jon Stewart (who readily admits that his target audience is 20something pot smokers) as though he's a hardline reporter. Yeah - Stewart is the Amanpour of Comedy Central. Give me a break. Giuliani also said the same things to ABC's "This Week" and Fox News Sunday (a hardline news show, not an editorial show). Maybe you'd like to take the legitimacy out from underneath ABC as well? I'll quote who I want, from whatever news source they happen to give the quote - thanks.
Speaking of ABC's This Week (and in response to your video), George Stephanopoulos also called Giuliani out for saying that previous convictions showed we are a nation of laws, our justice system works, yadda yadda. He replied that we have another, better alternative created for these circumstances. "In this particular case, we're reaching out to give terrorists a benefit that is not necessary. In fact, KSM when he was first arrested asked to be brought to NY. I didn't think we were in the business of granting the requests of terrorists." He added, "it also demonstrated that our federal system has an enormously protracted process that is going to go on forever, that it grants more benefits than a military tribunal will grant. There is always the possibility of acquittal, change of venue, and the reality is that it also creates an extra risk that isn't necessary."
"I'm troubled by the symbolism of it also," Giuliani added. He finished by saying that many people believe, with the benefit of post-9/11 retrospect, that trying the 1993 WTC bombers criminally was a mistake.
As my personal response, it's important to add that the "20th hijacker" Moussaoui was arrested inside the US and was mirandized. He was already here on our soil, we didn't parade him here on purpose. It's also worth mentioning that they had a hell of a time connecting him to the other 19 hijackers because the evidence was gathered in the shadows. We weren't able to pursue the death penalty on him because of it.
KSM and many detainees were arrested on foreign soil, should not be brought her under any circumstances, and much evidence we gathered from them was gathered under... let's say, extreme circumstances. It might be inadmissible, even if he shouts from the rooftops that he did it.
When one of these freaks gets let loose in midtown Manhattan because we couldn't build a case against them, maybe the president will have a reason to apologize for our country.
Say what you will about Jon Stewart, he is excellent at at calling out politicians, both left and right, for their contradictions and hypocrisy. Granted, it's a lot more often on the right side of the aisle, but he's certainly gone after everybody. Fox News, on the other hand, is almost entirely dedicated to being anti-Obama.
Nevertheless, do you honestly think that the President of the United States is going to let one of those "freaks" out in mid-town Manhattan? Do you really believe that? He's already said that none of them will be acquitted and that none will ever be free on US soil. The several cases where evidence is either shaky or it would be a national security issue to have some intelligence out in the open, are being tried in a military tribunal. Furthermore, do you honestly think a New York City jury is going to acquit KSM or another "terrorist"? Acquittals are rare enough in this country, let alone when a brown-skinned terrorist is sitting in front of a jury of New Yorkers.
Technicalities on the arrest of Moussaoui, nobody can argue that he wasn't a dangerous guy. Same goes for the 1993 hijackers. We were able to successfully give those individuals a fair and public trial, to show the world that are indeed a fair nation of laws.
Additionally, even on the REMOTE, almost improbably chance that one of these people is acquitted, do you really think we're just going to let them walk free? Of course note. They'll be re-arrested on a lesser charge or deported to be kept in a secret military prison.
Giving "bad guys" rights is almost never popular. However, these people were picked up abroad and have not been allowed to see a lawyer. Can you imagine the OUTRAGE that would ensue if two Americans were picked up in a foreign country, tortured, and kept locked away for six years by a sovereign nation? We'd be demanding to go to war. Alas, this is an opportunity to prove that they are getting a fair trial. The same way the Bush Administration tried Moussaoui. The same way the fake Iraqi government gave Saddam a "trial," and the same way we've been doing for the most dangerous of offenders for the last two hundred years.
This fake logic that one will get acquitted and just "released" into mid-town Manhattan is just a red herring and a scare tactic It's not right and it's mis-leading.
I really appreciate you vocalizing the opposing point of view. There are a lot of issues where there should be different approaches (education, health care, taxation) but keeping our people safe should be a non-starter.
Look, these people are not simply "freaks" with quotes to make ourselves feel better. I'm talking about FREAKS. Period. To be crystal clear about who we're talking about, I'm talking about Islamofascists who WANT TO DIE to become martyrs and have no regard for the lives of others, especially us - who they regard as infidels. We're talking about psychopathic, narcissistic, bomb-strapped freaks who want you and your family dead. Dead as a doornail. They don't "deserve" to touch American soil, and they don't "deserve" the great latitude that our criminal court system would allow them. They also don't "deserve" an open mic to spew their anti-Americanism.
It will level the playing field of debate if we can be honest that we're not talking about nice individuals who fell off the wagon, and we're not talking about people who can be reasoned with, rehabilitated, or least of all - trusted.
This is about symbolism yes, but not the symbolism that the president and the AG seem hellbent on. It doesn't matter if we invite these terrorists (and that's what they are) to cocktail parties and chauffer them around and let them make calls at taxpayer expense and take them to Disney. No amount of playing grab-ass with these people is going to make Al Qaeda, the Taliban, or any extremists around the world like us better. It's not going to happen. They are wackadoos to the tenth power, and MUST not be coddled.
If the president cares about the symbolism, then the symbolism should be simple: You can't kill, harm, or even threaten Americans. If you do, we will put our foot up your ass. That's the kind of tough leadership that I want when I go to the ballot box. We shouldn't have a president beg the UN for us to take care of our own people, our own interests, or our own enemies. I don't want a president that gives a flying f*** what France thinks about our foreign affairs, unless it's our relationship directly with France (just as one example of a country who is supposed to be our "strong ally" but who mysteriously is MIA when we need foreign assistance of practically any sort).
Say what you want about GW (and I have plenty of venomous things to say about some of his decisions myself), but his "cowboy diplomacy" gave psychos around the world pause when they realized that he was fully prepared to use our military muscle on those who would (and did) do us harm, as well as anyone who harbors them, aids them, or hides them. In that department, he gets an A+ from me.
I can't make it any more clear: We mustn't return to the naivete of pre 9/11 mentality. This is war, and we must win. The lives of your family and mine LITERALLY depend on it. There is NO compromise.
Get back to me when you figure out what the definition of "winning" in a fictitious "War on Terror" is. There can not possibly be a point when are are like "Ok, well that's settled." A war on "terror" is like having a war on jealousy. It just isn't a logical solution.
While you're correct that KSM and others are "FREAKS" who are hell bent on killing Americans. You must not forget that they hate us for a reason. Largely our presence in Saudi Arabia.
Nevertheless, while trying these people in New York will certainly serve to improve our standing in the eyes of much of Europe, there's a much more important group of people: The middle east. Guantanamo Bay has become one of the greatest recruiting tools in creating NEW terrorists, who would have had no previous desire to hurt innocent Americans. This is one reason that closing it, or at least the symbolism of doing so, was important. Similarly, we must look to the middle east to be a fair and impartial nation that doesn't loathe all people who are brown. Otherwise, we raise the risk of creating more terrorists and only hurting our interests in the long-term.
By the way, on a side note, I really don't like how Bush's "cowboy diplomacy" is used as a selling point on how he kept us safe. Or for that matter, that the fact he kept us safe for seven years after is some spectacular feat. By that token, so did the first George Bush, so did Reagan and so did Carter. Bush did, however, manage to let the worst terrorist attack on US soil in history happen under his watch. Even after receiving various warnings about the impending threat. If 9/11 happened under Obama's watch today, and we found out later he received a memo just weeks prior proclaiming "Bin Laden determined to strike US" or another warning of terrorists using commercial airliners to blow up buildings, I have a strange feeling that the right wing would be demanding impeachment trials, not lauding him for his reaction afterwards. I'm not saying this to bash Bush, enough of that has been done already, but I just don't think you should give him that much credit.
Even if you exclude 9/11, you shouldn't laud Bush for doing some crackerjack job by keeping us safe for seven years after the fact. Maybe we woke up a little after 9/11, but that day certainly didn't signal the start of some jihadic race to kill Americans. They had been wanting to hurt us for years before 9/11. In fact, they did. After the first World Trade Center bombing, Clinton also managed to keep the homeland safe from Muslim extremists 7 years. I don't see you lauding Clinton's southern charm and charisma for keeping us safe for those seven years. Obama has kept us safe for eleven months, where's his praise?
My problem is that 9/11, while a terrible day, wasn't the start of some new era of people hell bent on killing Americans. Those people were around long before 9/11 and will be around for years afterwards. If anything, 9/11 gave us some good will in places of the world that we badly needed it. Instead, we squandered it with our over the top reaction and with the loss of our values by torturing people, keeping them indefinitely without trial and invading a sovereign nation which didn't attack us.
It's a little ironic that 11 months into Obama's presidency, people still blame Bush for the mess that Obama "inherited" but somehow 8 months into Bush's presidency, leftover Clinton policy that left us unsafe is also Bush's fault? That logic escapes me.
I give Bush credit because he acted strongly and fundamentally changed the way we fight terrorism. That's the point. I'm not some Bush lover, believe me. But he gave us the tools we need to fight people who represent no country, do not declare war before they launch it, and fight in the shadows. The idea that Clinton kept our homeland safe after the 93 bombings is a joke. AFTER that, we had Black Hawk Down, the embassy bombings, the Oklahoma City bombing, the USS Cole, etc etc etc. Under Bush, we had exactly none of that post 9/11. That's my point as far as him giving the world pause.
We are slowly reverting back to traditional crime-fighting tactics under this president (reverting to tools from the pre-Bush era) and that scares me. While freely accepting one's place to disagree with that assessment, but it is one I hold firmly.
OF COURSE we have to watch out how we handle relations with the middle east, but being disingenuous with the middle eastern people doesn't help. We need to call terrorists and extremists exactly what they are so that we recognize that we ARE NOT talking about everyday, God-fearing (or Allah-fearing for all I care), patriotic citizens that also happen to be middle eastern. If we don't identify, separate, and obliterate these surly elements then we are doomed to forever have them plague the rapport of the Arab and Muslim communities. 100 percent agree that would be a disaster.
Thank you again, sincerely for the time you took to put into these comments. I enjoyed our back and forth. Please look forward to a few more blog posts in the next couple of weeks on the health care debate as well as foreign policy and national security issues!